Let's Ride w/ Paul Estrada
Who else is trying to figure $hit out?
Welcome to Lets Ride w/ Paul Estrada – the podcast where a dad tackles the big questions of life, career, and everything in between, by talking to interesting people that have the answers!
When I turned 18, I lost sleep at night with questions that Google was not yet sophisticated enough to answer: What career should I pursue? How can I be more than just average? And how do successful people get to where they are (was there a secret handbook I didn't know about)? After 22 years of pondering these existential dilemmas, I’ve finally pieced together some answers – An answer that is sufficient for now, but one always in need of refinement.
Join me each week as my 6 ½ year old son, Adrian, throws out a thought-provoking question or idea, and I invite a guest to help me sufficiently respond to him. From learning about money and investing, to finding a passion in life, and exploring careers that can be meaningful for you, we cover it all with a dose of humor and some soundbites of wisdom.
So, if you’re a parent or a young adult navigating these tricky waters, or if you want confirmation that other people are sometimes just as lost as you, you’ve come to the right place.
Let's Ride w/ Paul Estrada
Police Officer: 30 Years on Patrol
Behind the badge lies a father, husband, and grandfather whose story reveals the profound human dimension of law enforcement rarely glimpsed by those outside the profession. Mario Estrada spent three decades patrolling the gang-infested streets of East Los Angeles on the midnight shift, facing life-threatening situations while somehow managing to leave the trauma at the station door when his shift ended.
The heart of this episode unfolds when father and adult son sit down for a candid discussion about the realities of a 30-year law enforcement career. The retired officer recounts his journey from feeling "rudderless" after high school to finding purpose in the Marine Corps, which eventually led him to his calling in police work. His stories from patrolling gang-infested areas on the graveyard shift reveal both the danger and deep sense of purpose that defined his professional life.
In one of the most powerful moments, the father describes a shootout where he believed he might never see his family again – an experience he kept hidden from his wife until after retirement. This protection of loved ones from workplace trauma highlights the invisible emotional burden carried by first responders. Despite facing life-threatening situations regularly, he maintained a remarkable ability to compartmentalize, never bringing the horrors of work home to his family.
The conversation explores how values transfer between generations, with the son recognizing how his father's work ethic and dedication shaped his own approach to parenting and professional life. There's poignant reflection on what it means to lead by example rather than words, and how experiences that weren't prioritized in one generation become foundations for success in the next.
The episode concludes with thoughtful consideration of society's perception of police officers and the unfairness of judging an entire profession by the actions of a few. Throughout this intimate family discussion, listeners gain rare insight into the human side of law enforcement and the legacy of values that flow from generation to generation.
What was it like being a police officer?
Speaker 2:Being a police officer was a lot of things. It was something I enjoyed very much doing. Sometimes it was very scary, sometimes it was fun.
Speaker 1:Did it mean a lot of things to you.
Speaker 2:It sure did. It meant that I could help people whoever called and asked for it, or I could, you know, keep the streets safe and or try to find bad guys, or maybe somebody gets lost, like an old person or a young child, and I'd find them and get them back home safely. And it was a lot of things.
Speaker 1:True, I mean that's a good answer, oh thank you very much. What is it like to be a papa oh?
Speaker 2:man, I love being a papa because I'm your papa, that's what you. I'm your grandfather, but you call me papa, which I love. Yeah, it's like a short it is one of the best things in my life, because I like spending time with all my grandkids. I love to go see them play their games.
Speaker 1:Oh, but wait um, papa's spelled P-A-P-A, that's correct and my truck is called the Popinator.
Speaker 2:And, like today, you and I spent time together today. Remember what we did. Oh, yeah, we went to Camelot and I did a trick shot. You did a trick shot and you did like three or four holes in one.
Speaker 1:You were amazing. Yeah, you can ask me a couple questions. Oh, I sure would, okay.
Speaker 2:What's your favorite today to do miniature golf, or like when we go swimming in the summer, or when we go fishing which one do you like the best?
Speaker 1:Honestly, I like all of them.
Speaker 2:Okay, good answer. Yeah, they're all pretty fun. Different things are pretty good.
Speaker 1:You just make them fun.
Speaker 2:Oh, thank you. That's because I enjoy it Hanging out with you so much and spending time with you and all my grandkids.
Speaker 1:Okay, now you're going to talk with somebody else, guys okay, it's going to be my dad.
Speaker 2:Can you introduce him?
Speaker 1:Who. We were kind of talking about my dad when he was young, but now he's like an adult, like you know, like as you know. So bye, bye.
Speaker 3:Hi, let's Ride. Listeners, it's your friend, paul Estrada. If you've gotten any value out of any of the episodes, I'm here to ask you to pause this episode and take a moment to subscribe to the show. Wherever you're listening to this podcast, if you're a real go-getter, please take a moment to leave a review of the podcast. I'd be indebted to you forever. Thank you for supporting and listening to the show and for going on this journey with us. Pause, subscribe and let's ride. Our guest today is a 30-year veteran of the Los Angeles Sheriff's Department, where he spent the bulk of his career working the graveyard shift, patrolling the gang-infested streets of East Los Angeles. He spent his career helping those in need, regularly risking his life to protect and serve others. Despite facing life threatening situations regularly, he maintained a remarkable ability to compartmentalize never bringing the challenges of work home to his family.
Speaker 3:He's a father husband a remarkable ability to compartmentalize, never bringing the challenges of work home to his family. He's a father husband and a papa to his four, going on five grandchildren. He also happens to be my dad. Our guest today is Mario Estrada. All right, come on and take me anywhere that you want to be, so let's ride. All right, dad, I'm going to start with one of the hardest hitting questions at the very beginning, and that is why'd you make me pull so many damn weeds in the backyard?
Speaker 2:Well, because, you were good at it. That's why, oh geez. So I said I'm going to use this kid because he's got a talent right there.
Speaker 3:so I I was just like as I was, as I was thinking about this conversation. Yeah, and moments from childhood that was like kind of a mundane one, but I just remember every time like hey, it's saturday, you got to pull weeds, and I just think of every excuse of why that was not a good idea oh, you did it, though you never complained.
Speaker 2:complained I never. I don't know, I definitely complained.
Speaker 3:You might just not remember that part. Oh well, baby, but um yeah, I think I got smarter after a while and, uh, I started watering the night before, which was just oh, I do.
Speaker 2:I do remember you doing that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's right, Smart too which was a huge leg up.
Speaker 2:So no, I'm just kidding.
Speaker 3:I think the reason why I say that is because in some of these conversations that I've been having is trying to help myself and other people understand, like how we're raising kids and some of the different methods that we use to do that. Right. And when I think back to that time, you know the weeds weren't that big a deal. But I'm just curious, like, did you really want your backyard looking that nice or was there more? Like you know I need to give this kid like this kid needs to be doing something. He's got it too easy.
Speaker 2:No, it was really to make the yard look nice, you know, because you let them go and it gets out of hand. But no, that was it wasn't. It wasn't disciplined at all. It was just a chore. You know it's, it's a common one. I think a lot of kids are. I don't have to do it anymore. But back then that was a big thing when I was a kid. Yeah, we were weed, pooling fools too back then.
Speaker 3:So we I did a lot, so no, it wasn't discipline at all, I think it's just. You were a good kid, yeah, I. And you know, what's funny is when I I'd be in the middle of that and I would just, and you know, fast forward to today, and that's exactly what I have, like I have so I was slightly traumatized by it or I felt like I had just done enough weed pulling into my for a full lifetime and just never.
Speaker 2:You know, funny you mentioned that now that I think about it back when, when you were young, and when I was young especially we didn't have gardeners. You didn't see that many gardeners out there. Everybody did their own lawn. So I it's just a changing of times. I guess.
Speaker 3:Now that's all you see. Mostly it's. You have gardeners that come in every month and stuff, so times have changed, yeah. So, like joking aside, I think one of the things that um comes to my mind first and foremost when I think about growing up was the how much education was pushed on us and and put. When I say push, I mean in a good way and to the point where you know all three of your kids graduated from, you know got a four-year degree, and you know our sister, your daughter, that got an advanced degree. And looking back at how you mentioned how you grew up and how that was not something necessarily that was a priority or pushed on you like right, but it was a huge priority, like you talked, you and mom talked about it constantly. Yeah, what, like? What drew you, but it was a huge priority, you and mom talked about it constantly. What drew you to make that such a priority, given that it wasn't a priority necessarily for you Back, when I was growing up.
Speaker 2:It wasn't pushed on us by my parents at all, we just kind of did our own thing. But what I did realize and notice that people that were going to college were getting ahead in life a lot easier. I mean it wasn't easy going to college, but I mean after you got your degree things were better for them. So I knew that you kids, I was going to push education for you guys. Now, if it turned out that you didn't do well in school, or either any of you didn't do well, then I wouldn't push it. You know, sometimes college is not for everybody and you can still make your way doing other things look at me right. But I felt it was important that I tried to give you kids that advantage and I think it worked out nicely.
Speaker 3:No, 100, I did, I just, and that was what you just saw certain friends of yours that you went to school with that were doing better, like I'm just curious what? Because you, you guys, were very adamant about this. So yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was just yeah. I had friends who were my parents you know good parents but they didn't push education very much at all. So, like we just go to school, which is, you know, I went to a private school, as well as my brothers and sisters, your uncles and aunts, but they never pushed it. I mean, I did my own thing. Sometimes I'd do my homework in the morning before I go to school Sounds familiar.
Speaker 2:It was kind of ridiculous now that I think back on that. But I would see my friends and I would look at the newspaper and see people getting their degrees and doing this type of job, this other type of great job, making more money than your average person. So I knew I wanted that for you guys and I was going to push it. And, like I said, if it's something that you really really weren't akin to or that you are gravitated towards, then I wouldn't have pushed it anymore. Like I said, you can do other things as well, but I wanted to put that first and see if that was for you, and does that come from?
Speaker 3:just because you didn't have it as like, you had it harder and you've you experienced it. So that's why you didn't want us to, like, go through the same thing, or is it something?
Speaker 2:yeah, you know when I finished or getting near graduating from high school, I was rudderless. You know, I go. What am I gonna do? I go, I've got. I don't know. I didn't apply for colleges. I didn't apply for colleges in high school. I don't think I you that before but never did, because nobody pushed you to do that. I mean, as a kid, you do need a certain amount of coaxing to do certain things, certain good things, and that wasn't my case. My parents were not college graduates either, so I don't know if that's why they didn't push it on me, but I realized that it was an important aspect of getting ahead in this world and taking care of your family.
Speaker 3:But that's what I'm trying to figure out is I know you didn't go to school, but your oldest brother graduated from UCLA, which is a very high end university. You have a sister that graduated, I think, with the master degree from Columbia University, which I think is an Ivy League school, right?
Speaker 2:It is Ivy League yeah.
Speaker 3:So very well educated siblings. So what's my excuse? Very well educated siblings, so what's my excuse? But that, coming from what I'm trying to put, connect the dots right Because, like, when I look at the family now, there's definitely a value on education, but it sounds like you and your siblings were not pushed in that direction yet somehow ended up, like I said, going to these prestigious universities and even the ones that didn't like you and Uncle Marty are doing like did very well professionally. So I'm just trying to connect the dots on. How was that possible when there wasn't that driving force behind you guys? How was it possible we succeeded, yeah, all you guys succeeded in that way.
Speaker 2:We weren't lazy, that's a key thing right there. We were all good people. We didn't want to do bad things but we wanted to find our niche in life. Like I said, I knew nothing about higher education, or very little. It wasn't pushed on me like we discussed, but we were hard workers and, like I said, after I graduated, or getting near graduating high school, I was rudderless and I was happy, go lucky. And then it finally hit me. I'm like what am I doing? Where am I going? After this I said, oh my goodness. So that kind of worked out because a friend of mine who I'd gone to high school with and he joined the Marine Corps and he came back after bootcamp and told me all about the Marine Corps and then I said to myself that's it, that's my next step.
Speaker 3:And Was it like immediately as he was talking, that happened, or you had to go home and think about it for a minute?
Speaker 2:No, no, no. When I saw him in uniform, he came back in uniform. Okay, and I said, but immediately I liked it. I said oh man.
Speaker 3:You liked the uniform or you liked what? No, what he had to say oh yeah, I like the uniform, we got the best uniforms.
Speaker 2:Come on, dress blues. The way he was talking about the Marine Corps and the discipline involved and how hard it was, I was drawn to the difficulty of finishing Marine Corps boot camp. But he would tell us, you know, we all played football together and we had this thing in high school called Hell Week, which was conditioning week for us, and it was horrible physically. You know. They made us go to these. We sweated and it was bad. It was bad. And so this friend of mine his name was jesse he came back and he said remember how weak? I said, yeah, how can I forget? He goes. Marine corps boot camp makes it look like a walk in the park and my eyes just opened wide.
Speaker 2:Yes, that sounds awesome I said, man, I want to do that really I was drawn to that.
Speaker 2:I really like the discipline and the way he talked to marine corps yeah if he talks to other Marines and you're never ex-Marine, as you know, you're always a Marine but they'll tell you about the pride that's involved with it. You knowing me through all growing up, you know how proud I am of that Marine Corps. And so, anyway it turned out. It was a great, great move for me. It just kind of like God sent it to me, like send this guy to him, and it was like that's it. It was like the light went on. I said that's it, that's what I'm supposed to do.
Speaker 3:And that's it. So you said okay, so you talked to this guy, but, like I said, was it immediate, was it? You went back that night? Was it a couple of weeks, months later, before you? No, it was.
Speaker 2:It was the. The attraction to it was immediate. Okay, but I didn't decide. I was going to do it immediately.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:So I go home and man, it was in my brain, it was like wow, so I went home Like I thought you just couldn't get, you couldn't shake it out.
Speaker 2:Right, you know, and I started doing some research on the Marine Corps and talked to other Marines and started telling people around me, you know, I think I'm going to go to the Marine Corps, not really meaning it at the time, but it just evolved, I would say, within you know, like a month or two, and I almost kind of talked myself in the corner. You know, okay, I told these people.
Speaker 3:I was going to the Marine Corps.
Speaker 2:I better go in now. Yeah, you know, seriously, that was kind of the way it happened, but I was probably done. This is the direction I'm supposed to take and I was really drawn to patriotism too. I always loved my country. I wanted to give back, and that's one of the biggest ways you can give back, right there, absolutely, I said this is it, I'm in, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we could talk about them. We got started. They've heard some those that have been listening to this. I've heard the stories. In fact, I was just telling well, we'll hear, get your perspective on this and then and then we'll move on.
Speaker 3:But I was explaining about our good neighbor, nick, growing up and how his dad was in the Navy and how he would come over here and you basically wouldn't let him if he would say any ill speak, any will, ill will against the Marine Corps he was going to have hell to pay for it until he agreed that it was the best branch in the military. So yeah, can't forget those stories. Yeah, yeah, all right. So you go to the military and you come out. You know, you said before like hey, you're rudderless. Yes, did you feel like when you came out, you had a rudder.
Speaker 2:I kind of yeah, I knew I was going to go to college. Okay, well, let me put it this way. I said I think I'm supposed to go to college now.
Speaker 2:You know, it wasn't really like yeah, I'm going to college, I want to study this, I want to do this, and then that's it Right, it wasn't. I just felt I think I should go to college. I got the GI Bill now, but I'm glad I didn't. I'm not that it's a bad job, of course it's a great job, but it's just not me. So I went to college, I got my AA. Then I transferred to Cal State, la. I was in college there and I forget how. I was into it pretty deep and I was sitting in an accounting class one day and I'm trying to focus and it just was not interesting me one day. And I'm trying to focus and it just was not interesting me, and then it was like another light goes on in my head, going what am I doing here? What am I doing?
Speaker 3:here. You got a high electricity bill in that brain of yours.
Speaker 2:That dark bulb was going on throughout my life. It sure does. But I said this is not me, I go. You know, I had my, we had you guys go through it. But, like I said, for some people it's just not there, it's, it's not something you should do. So I, I stopped college well, you know it was.
Speaker 3:It was um. Since you say that, you said, and again, this is not in a bad way, but the way you and and mom positioned it, it's as if there was, there was no other option like you're gonna get your degree. And again, like you weren't, not like you were forcing, but it's just the way you've set the foundation right, talked about it, the way you spent a lot of money in our elementary and high school years, right, it's like I mean, come on, guys, like you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:So now, to tell you the truth, the way we put it out there, uh, we said kind of like, no, you're going to college right now.
Speaker 3:Had you said to come to me and say, dad, I'm just not open to college, I just don't want to do it, I would have said, okay, let's find you something else, so the doors weren't closed to you yeah, no, and, like I said, I didn't feel, I didn't feel that way, it just felt more like right, it was the natural progression, like it had gotten ingrained in such a way right that it felt like there was no other, even though, like you said, even though there would have been other options, in my mind it's like no, there isn't another option, this is what you need to go do next.
Speaker 2:That was what I meant to do. Have it in your mind that you're going to college and it worked out great.
Speaker 3:Obviously, you guys turned out great, so it was the right thing to do no complaints? Yeah, was the right thing to do no complaints? Yeah, okay, so you, you're going to school and you know it's not working out to get your degree and like, what do you decide to do after that?
Speaker 2:Well, I was working for um UPS. I worked for my, for my uncle, my uncle Ray. He had a like a janitor business which I hated oh my God, I hated that, uh, but it was a job, honest job, uh. And then I got a good job at UPS you know, our parcel service and I did that for a couple of years but it was still not what I wanted to do, you know. So I thought what you know, I was always into paramilitary kind of job, wearing a uniform and stuff like that. So then I thought law enforcement. I said that's it, it.
Speaker 2:I don't know why the light bulb, there's that boy, there it is. I heard the click, oh, click. I said why I did not think of this before is beyond me. I know part of the problem I was. You know, I was still single, uh, before you guys came along and I was having good time with my friends, and so my, I kind of run the list again, but kind of kind of not yeah, but uh, finally, uh, my bulb came on and said yes, law enforcement, that's me, that's what I want to do. So that's how that started.
Speaker 3:And were you was? I can't remember, was that, was I already born at that time, or like what? What prompted your decision where you're just like okay, I need to find like a something super steady at this point decision where you're just like okay, I need to find something super steady at this point.
Speaker 2:Yes, actually, ups would provide us with a very good living as well, because back then I don't know how it is now, but the pay was good, but it wasn't a job for me, it wasn't something I wanted to do for the rest of my life. I really wanted to find something that I wanted to do, that I was interested in doing and it would make me want to go to work every day, you know. And also something that could feed my family well and keep my family taken care of Right. And just once again, there's my light bulb. Yeah, I said there's law enforcement. So I looked into it. I saw the pay was really good, I saw the retirement was outstanding and all the benefits were excellence. I said this is it.
Speaker 3:This is it. So you make that decision, you go through all the training and whatnot. What is? Do you remember the first day, or the first week, or just the beginning of when you were like an officially a police officer, wearing that uniform? Like just what was going through your mind in those early days.
Speaker 2:It was awesome to put that uniform on. You know, yeah. And like they told us in the academy okay, go home, stand in front of the mirror, draw your gun a few times and act like you know Wild West guy and then put it away. Yeah, and he read all our minds, so yeah.
Speaker 3:But it was awesome.
Speaker 2:Putting on that uniform was just like yeah, I was very proud.
Speaker 3:I was very proud of myself. And where did you, did you tell me you started in the jail first.
Speaker 2:No, I started with a department called the LA County Marshal's Department which is, which was not for me, and I'll explain it a little bit later. It was a department took care of the courts, you know, and they had jails in there and yeah, I would work the jail there and, you know, monitor the prisoners and all that stuff like that. So you weren't out on the street at this point. Actually, I did go in the Marshal's department. There's a thing called the warrant unit where you would search for suspects.
Speaker 3:But it wasn't like patrol. Yeah, it wasn't patrol.
Speaker 2:So it wasn't me, okay. So after a couple of years, actually, the Sheriff's department. This worked out. There's another thing that worked out for me. So this Marshall's department was a county department and our LA County Sheriff's department was also a county department. We got paid exactly the same. We got paid, we were on the same retirement organization and what happened was that the huge Sheriff's department took over the Marshall's department right at the time I was trying to transfer out to the Sheriff's department. Okay, it was like I was thinking, well, are they doing this for me, because this is working out perfectly? Yeah, so we were in Marshall's uniforms one day, literally, and the next day we were in sheriff's uniforms. Okay, and I felt even better.
Speaker 3:And is that what transitioned you into patrol at this point?
Speaker 2:Yes, I had. Even in the marshal department. I had always wanted to be a street cop. Okay, your classic street cop. That's what I wanted to do. That was what I was totally drawn to.
Speaker 3:And when you started that, what was your district or area that you were covering?
Speaker 2:My first station was East Los Angeles station. It's a very respected. The LA County Sheriff's Department has many, many stations. It's huge. I mean the annual budget is over $3 billion. I think it might be closer to $4 billion with a B nowadays, but it's huge. So the station I asked for and got, which is a pretty popular station to work, was called East LA Station. It was a pretty popular station of work. It was called east la station. It was a super busy station.
Speaker 3:Uh, the area is gang infested and, yeah, that's where I went to first and for people that aren't, that are listening to this, that aren't from la, how would you any? You're starting to describe it as gang infested, but yes the demographics, the I guess how the housing was, the type of people that were living there. Just to paint a picture of what the area was like.
Speaker 2:The area is by far Hispanic. By far all the people in that area are just hardworking, good people. But you have your criminal element, like I said, in this case your gangs there, and literally every neighborhood in the area we patrolled was gang infested. So it was bad. It was a very violent place, unsafe place at night. So, yeah, we were busy.
Speaker 3:So in addition to you working a dangerous area, you also were the graveyard shift right.
Speaker 2:Which is the most?
Speaker 3:dangerous time of the day right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was the busiest time of night.
Speaker 3:So you wanted this for yourself. You got it. Yes, was it in those early days? Was it what you thought it was going to be, or was it something different?
Speaker 2:it was actually harder than I thought it would be. Yeah, a lot harder. In regards to what you have to know for patrol. You need to know, so much.
Speaker 3:Yeah, this is before google maps and stuff.
Speaker 2:Right, yeah, yeah, we worked out of thomas guys back there but you, there's a lot, a lot to know as far as your laws of arrest, your um uh, suspicious, regional suspicion, uh uh, you know, I mean, I could tell, I could throw it all the time just a lot of technical legal terms out there and you got to know that stuff okay and that's just a small part of it.
Speaker 2:So that's a technical piece I'm thinking more of. I can throw it all the time. Just a lot of technical training, legal terms out there and you got to know that stuff. Okay, and that's just a small part of it.
Speaker 3:So that's the technical piece. I'm thinking more of just from a personal, like emotionally, just like how you're feeling about the situation that you are in career wise.
Speaker 2:I felt like this is me Okay and I felt like I can do some good here and I had the attitude that I wanted to do what you're supposed to do as a cop Right Keep people safe, catch the bad guys or whatever else I need to do to help people, right. So I knew I belonged there. I knew this is what I need to do. I'm here.
Speaker 3:That's awesome and admirable, and I think most police officers that's what they're there for, yeah. And then I'm sure you you run into reality, which is, I'm sure a lot of the people were very happy to have you there. And then, like you said, there's gang members and other people that are not happy to have you there, right, or even sometimes just I don't know whack jobs that are happy to have you there either, right? What was it like when you like came up against those types of people, like where you're trying to do something good and these people are just resisting, like you trying to literally help them?
Speaker 2:Oh, yeah, we'd run into that all the time. Yes, most people are thankful, but yeah, we'd run into that all the time. For example, you'd be bringing in a gang member and every once in a while I heard this more than once he goes you're a traitor to our race, I go, I go, I go, a traitor, I'm doing something good here and I'm the bad guy. But I wouldn't talk to him after that unless I had to, because it's going nowhere.
Speaker 3:But even like those gang members, family members that are obviously it's their children or their uncle or their whatever that just see you as someone taking them away, as opposed to doing the good that you're actually doing, right, well, surprisingly there were a lot of gang members' parents who supported us.
Speaker 2:Of course they didn't want to see their children go to jail, you know. But you got to realize that a lot of these parents are helpless in helping their kids in areas like that because their kids are confronted by other gang members threatening them to get in the gangs to join them. So a lot of times the parents don't have a choice. I mean they could try to move out of the area which is, economically, is real tough for a lot of them. So they're kind of stuck in a rut, I mean in a bad, you know, catch 22 position there. So not always, but yeah, you're right, sometimes we would. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, not always, but, yeah, you're right, sometimes we would, yeah, yeah, just talk about working in an area like that, coming up against just some of the more challenging situations you had talked earlier about, like they're just being frightening situations, scary moments. I'm assuming that there's certain ones that really stand out in your mind.
Speaker 2:Oh, absolutely.
Speaker 3:Yeah, can you speak to one in as much detail as you feel comfortable? Oh, I can tell you. Speak to one in as much detail as you feel comfortable.
Speaker 2:Oh, I can tell you, the one that sticks out the most to me is because I remember this, because I thought to myself in the situation. It was so bad that I might not see my family again. It was bad and just can you like, yeah, describe what was happening? I was working and I was a single man in a patrol car. Sometimes we had two patrol car One of our other units picked up on a stolen vehicle and so it was rolling.
Speaker 2:So he gets behind it and you know we coordinate the call. He gets on what they call the patch, which means everybody. It opens up so everybody can hear him on the radio that he was in pursuit of a stolen car and there were gang members inside that stolen car. So I catch up to them. I'm like the second or third vehicle behind the lead police vehicle, and so this gang member goes into, he turns into a dead end, a cul-de-sac. So he said, okay, he's trapped there. So he stops and we stopped behind him. He, the passenger side, jumps out of the car. He's got AK 47 in his hand and he starts blasting at us.
Speaker 2:I mean it was horrible and I remember my train. They said, hey, our training in the academy. They said if you start receiving heavy gunfire, try to put yourself, try to put your engine block between you and uh, the suspect Right. And that's exactly what I did. I came, it came right back to my head, so I jumped behind there and I could hear the bullets zipping by me, hitting my car, blowing out my windshield.
Speaker 3:Uh, it was horrible, it was ugly and I thought oh man, and was that like the first big moment like that you've had, or was it?
Speaker 2:No, we've had others.
Speaker 3:But that was just the.
Speaker 2:That's got to be where I. There's a couple where I thought I might be injured or killed, yeah, but this one was kind of it. Was it just kind of different? It was just crazy. And so All heck broke loose that night.
Speaker 3:How did that? Did you eventually, I'm assuming you got out from there and you guys.
Speaker 2:So we get out and after you know we're on the ground and so we start shooting back and but you don't understand how bad you're overpowered. When somebody has a weapon like an AK-47 and we're shooting with our little nine millimeters, it's like you know, it's not easy. You're shot out gun. We had AR-15s in our vehicles but we couldn't get to them because bullets were flying. And then I remember, as I was sitting there with these's shooting, I would hear like snaps going past me. I go what the heck is that? That sounds like caps. And somebody told me later that was the bullets breaking the sound barrier right next to you. I said, oh, makes sense.
Speaker 3:I mean, I can't like how fast things are going through your head at that moment, but like when that guy gets out with a gun like that and starts firing, obviously you're it sounds like your training kicked in, so you did what you're supposed to do. Yeah, but like, what else is going through your head in moments like that In my head it was the fight back until they came in.
Speaker 2:It's like now we got it. We got to stop this. We got to stop this. The great thing about East LA stations. I worked with so many great cops and everybody that pulled up was in the same mindset that I was. You know, even one guy. We had two deputies that got shot in that encounter right there. Two guys got hit. Thankfully they lived. But as this guy was shooting, we had another deputy and there was still a deputy inside the front car that couldn't get out. We had another deputy crawl up to his side. There was another deputy in front and he went inside that car and pulled that guy out. It's like, oh my gosh, I didn't see it until later. It's like oh my God, because the bullets were flying like crazy.
Speaker 3:Does the thought of so? Obviously you're in a life or death situation and you've got to focus on what's happening there. But does your personal life, your family? Obviously it's not there, but like does any of that stuff creep in as well.
Speaker 2:Oh, absolutely. My first thought was you guys, you know, I said I don't know if I'm gonna, am I gonna see them again? It was that bad, you know, still makes me a little emotional. But yeah, it was tough, it was real tough, um. But even then my mindset was fight back, fight back. And I know that was in my other partner's heads too, because I saw them.
Speaker 3:They were fighting back, you know, and so and once everything kind of stabilizes and you guys get the situation under control, what is just like, I'm assuming just a lot of emotions and things are going through your like. What is that like?
Speaker 2:Kind of like it's like kind of mixture of chaos and kind of how proud you are of everybody, what they did, you know, cause it looks like wow and everybody was still let's go get that guy. That's, that's everybody's mindset. It wasn't just haphazard.
Speaker 3:We have training which kicks in, like I said before, right, and so you think about that and then you just think about, uh, staying safe, and then actually doing your job and get this guy so he doesn't hurt anybody else, right? But let's say once, once it's all over, your shift's over, you're changing back into your clothes and you kind of gotta. Now, I don't know, I'm assuming you're coming, you're coming home, yeah, and or I don't know, you call mom at some point, like hey I didn't tell your mom there's, there's so many things I didn't tell your mom.
Speaker 2:There's no sense for making her worries. She she already worried. Being a cop's wife is tough and so she didn't hear that stuff. So I didn't tell her this. After I retired, wow, and I told her. I said, babe, I never told you this. And then I told her what happened and she goes. What I said, yeah.
Speaker 3:But how do you because that's between those situations, the types of things that you encountered, and then to leave the station and have to basically shut that all off from your mind and be a husband, a dad, yeah, all those sorts of things some people are successful with it.
Speaker 2:I think I was oh, you were.
Speaker 3:That's what I'm saying, right? It's like yeah you would never know. Yeah, you know anything happened?
Speaker 2:I'd be. I'd be at your, you know, coaching one of your teams or being at your games, and you would never know Anything happened. I'd be at your, you know, coaching one of your teams or being at your games, and you would never know. The night before somebody tried to shoot me and I would never tell you. Guys, you heard about the fun stuff.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I remember that. The stuff no, I would never bring that home. But how do you? Because I know my personality and now that you're telling me this, I can't hold that sort of stuff Like, now that you're telling me this, I can't. I can't hold that sort of stuff Like I, I have to, like, in order for me to cope with things, I have to involve other people.
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, but you basically had to live this Well, I mean, maybe with your, your co co-workers, you guys can confide in one another a little bit but like, it's not that I'm a tough guy or a super brave guy, it's just that God blessed me with this wall of protection in that matter, as far as not taking it home with me, because I never did, no, never. And, to be honest, with you at home, with you guys, I was fine. Other of my partners were not so lucky. A lot of them got PTSD and, sadly, I know about four of my friends that shot themselves. Um, you know, suicide is, it's huge in police work and so, like I said, some people can't deal with it and you would never know because they seem like happy people, um, and then you hear the next day oh, so-and-so shot himself.
Speaker 3:That's what I'm saying. It just seems like you guys don't get paid and police officers in general don't get paid enough for what they're asked to do. One and then two, the burden that gets placed on them for what they have to see and what they have to do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's bad. Like I said, I was blessed. God protected me with this wall. That let me block it out when I needed to. Even to this day, I feel fine, I don't, but a lot of my friends don't, so I feel blessed for that. But yeah, I never took it home to even to this day. I feel fine, I don't, but a lot of my friends don't, yeah, you know, um, so I feel blessed for that. But uh, yeah, I never took took it home, that's pretty heavy.
Speaker 3:Let's, let's switch it a little bit. Oh uh. No, that's good. I appreciate you sharing that's really. Yeah, I'm good. But what about, like just more of the maybe the happier, a happier moment, or just something that you're really proud of, maybe helping a person a a family, anything like?
Speaker 2:that. That's a big part of the job, the satisfaction you get with helping people. I can remember a lot of times, you know, I was like I was thankful to be in this position where I could do that, and I was just like, wow, I love my job. Yeah, you know, for example, one time we lived in this, I worked in this area where it's very hilly, and we got a call.
Speaker 2:That's saying this lady said her elderly mother was missing. She walked away from the house she's like in her 80s or 90s or something like that and uh, and she was very distraught and she she said we looked everywhere, we can find her. She was crying and everything. I said, okay, we're gonna find her. So went on to the hills where where I was working, and we spread out out. We did what we did tactically I get the helicopter up and everything and we found her and literally in a ditch, you know. But she was okay. We got the medics out there and she was fine and thankfulness on everybody's, you know, the family's face. It just makes it all worth it. It's just like wow.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I get to do that. So do you feel like that kind of outweighed all the more challenging moments?
Speaker 2:Outweighed. Yes, yes. The reason that I could, the fact that I could do stuff like that, or all of us could do stuff like that, I made it all worth it, and I would do it again. Sounds crazy, but I would. I was meant to be a cop. Yeah, that was my job.
Speaker 3:That sure as heck sounds like it. Yeah, yeah, I think just some things like that I remember about, like I always definitely remember obviously none of this stuff I knew about yeah and you're retired 10 years now and I feel like still or longer than that 12 years yeah and like, still slowly, as we ask, you know, and your willingness to share, yeah, now that it's way behind you.
Speaker 3:Uh, you know it's, it's fascinating to learn about that. Yeah, but you know, growing up, you know you worked a lot, and you worked a lot of overtime, lots, and you were present a lot. I remember you being there a lot. The only thing I didn't do those days was sleep. Yeah, I know which I will talk about that in a second. But like, yeah, I remember you know certain hall, I mean because, look, I work a nine to five desk job. I get to take off the time that I need. Um, that's not what this job is about. You guys work. There is no, it's 24, seven, three, 65. You guys have to work. It's not healthy, that's for sure, yeah. And so you know you would miss certain holidays or things like that, and I never felt like like it was never an issue because, anytime someone would ask like hey, where's your dad?
Speaker 3:I'm like he's working Right, like obviously. But always when, when people would say that what would come in the back of my mind was being so proud of what you, what you were doing, like the reason why you were missing made it like not a big deal, like it would have been. Obviously it would have been nice to have you there. But knowing that you were doing something really meaningful was like yeah, that's where he needs, that's where he needs to be, and when he is home, like he'll make up the difference, like it'll be all good.
Speaker 2:Well, I'm so glad you felt that way and I'd love to hear that, because I never heard that before, so that actually is huge for me. So thank you, son.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I guess police officers have to sacrifice a lot, but I think, like you mentioned, their families and their wives or their husbands also have to sacrifice, which I think, and we don't. We don't get paid for that Right Like it's just um, yeah, that's a.
Speaker 2:That's another thing that the divorce rate for police officers is just, you know, horribly high. You know me and your mom. We've always had a wonderful marriage, so it wasn't an issue for us, thank God, you know, and plus your mom's, a wonderful woman.
Speaker 3:So because of what you did, it was like we had everything that we wanted, needed. We went to the best schools we had, like never you know wanted for for anything. So I mean it paid off like for sure in that sense. But again, like you worked 60, 70, 80 hour weeks. I mean and like consecutively for weeks, if not months at a time like what was, like, just I know why I'm guessing, I know why you did it, but just like the grind of putting yourself through something like that.
Speaker 2:It was tough, you know, but I would do it. Like I said I'm, I was glad to do it because I was able to take care of you guys so well and you remember all the great vacations we go on every year and I always wanted for that for you guys and that's why you do it for your kids nowadays. So I love to see that. But yeah, it was tough. It was like I said.
Speaker 2:Literally I didn't sleep in those days. I would work graveyards all night long. I would do a lot of overtime at the courts because it was a little bit easier than working patrol all the time. So I would go and I would sleep. I would drive, get off of work at six in the morning, I'd drive to the courthouse, I would drive. I'd get off of work at six in the morning, I'd drive to the courthouse, parking in the parking lot, sleep for like 20 minutes and then get up and go work at the courthouse during the day. Then I'd come home and coach one of you guys in one of your sports or go to one of your games and stuff, but all worth it for me. I'd do it all again.
Speaker 3:And I can't? Yeah, I can't, possibly, I think because of what you did. I get to work office job that I do very well. Yes, you do. I don't have to work the overtime because I do well. But there's other things and I've been talking about that a lot on this podcast as well which is I have my day job, but I don't stop there. I'm doing this podcast, which is taking a decent amount of my time. I'm doing the real estate stuff. I'm coaching the kids.
Speaker 3:Baseball is like yeah it's a lot to take on and I sometimes ask myself what's the driving force behind that, and I think it's just because you and I, like you and I don't talk explicitly, talk about those things, but I think it's more so just it's like leading by actions or example, rather than us needing to sit down and you verbalize, like what needed to happen or how you should go about things yeah it's more.
Speaker 3:It was more. So now that I think about it was just watch how I'm doing this and then learn a thing or two, yeah, so I think that's because I've been asking myself, like why am I putting myself there? Because it's it's a lot like, been asking myself like, like why am I putting myself there?
Speaker 3:because it's it's a lot like, kind of like you mentioned right again, I don't have the emotional, the physical component that you talked about, so I can't, I can't put myself in the same boat as you, but it is exhausting yeah, in a different way like you're doing the things that I'm taking on and um, but it feels like it's possible and yeah, um, you know I, you know my sister, my brother, that all have that same mentality of just we're doing well, but we're going to keep pushing the envelope of what's possible. And I think you know and I need to give credit to mom too which was on the flip side of you working and doing all that you effectively have like a single parent kind of like you guys have a healthy and great relationship, but now, being a parent, I have an appreciation for what she does because, you know, christine and I share household responsibilities, the childcare responsibilities, and you were working, so mom had to either do it herself or find ways to do a lot of stuff too right.
Speaker 2:Your mom was amazing, jeez, louise. Yeah, your mom did everything. She was even at school all the time with a PTA, or she worked. She had a full-time job. Yeah, your mom was a big reason we have the success that we had both in our marriage. We have one of the best marriages I've seen. It's truly, you know, she's to thank for a lot of that stuff. So, yeah, your mom, you need to make this a successful career. Police officer. You need somebody who supports you and can see how hard it is to get through, and that they need that support. And in turn, I gave her back support and it just worked out. We were very, very lucky because it's it's hard to be a police officer spouse, whether you're a male police officer or female. It's tough, it's tough. I'd do it all again.
Speaker 3:Yeah, all right. Yeah, so when I talk about what I said earlier, about you kind of more so leading by example or rather than like sitting me down and necessarily verbalizing things you did a little bit of that, but I think it was more so just setting it by example. And now we're adults, we have our own kids and stuff like that, like how do you think it all worked out?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it worked out perfectly. I mean, you're a great father, you're a great husband, you're, you work hard, we know that, and you're successful. So a parent couldn't ask for more than that.
Speaker 3:Well, yeah, I guess, when you think about whatever you and mom had goals that you guys had set for what you wanted your children to become, we talked about the education piece, but I, you know, we talked about becoming successful and contributing members of society. Right, I don't know, it just seems like your plan worked out pretty well. Whatever your plan was, you know, it seemed to work out pretty well. I'm just trying to think about it from the perspective of now, like I'm not the kid anymore, I'm, I'm the, I'm in your shoes and just trying to figure out how to do that. Make sure that we have the same level of success.
Speaker 2:Well, as long as you keep family number one, and everything else will fall into place. You know what you. You're a smart person. You know what you have to do to be successful in that aspect and you're doing it. You obviously paid attention, you obviously saw what we did and you learned from it, and now you're doing it and you're doing well. So, yeah, people have different types of parenting techniques. I guess you would call them for lack of a better term so it worked out for us. So I'm happy to see how everything turned out.
Speaker 3:So you went through a huge grind for was it 25 years, 30 years, 30 years, yeah, 30 years. And then, like you mentioned at the beginning of this, one of the benefits of well, there's many that you talked about, but was that you put in 30 years and at the end of that 30 years, you're rewarded with a good retirement life, right?
Speaker 2:Well, that's a good thing about police work. First of all, you get an outstanding retirement package, plus you get to retire early. I retired at 55 years old. I remember sitting there the day after going. I'm cheating the system because I feel like I want to get back in a patrol car, but I do well, okay, I'm done, I missed it. It's starting to wane a little bit at 12 years after retire. But wanting to go back in a patrol car or do police work, but yeah, I did miss it. That's how much I missed it. But yeah, the retirement benefits are outstanding as long as you keep your health.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I was lucky in that, except for a couple of my joints, you know, I'm in excellent health. You know, Mom and I travel all over the place and we get to see our grandkids all the time, and so you got to maintain your health, whereas a lot of my, you know that's another reason why police get to retire at a young age, because, statistically, we die at a younger age, right. So, which a lot of my friends have and a lot of my friends are, they're beat up. I mean, their bodies are, you know. They have problems with their heart, diabetes, joints, you name it. They got problems. Again, god blessed me and I'm an excellent in health, so yeah, but the retirement is great. I mean, it was all worth it.
Speaker 3:I think the last thing I want to talk about is I remember when I, like I said, growing up, I was very proud of what you did. I still am Still very grateful for what our police and military do for us today and, I know, for you. It's been kind of tough because in the last five, six, seven years there's kind of been a group of people that have decided that you know, because there's a couple of bad police officers that there's, that they're all bad, or they just come up with these crazy ideas about how much does that, does that bother you? And if so oh, absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 2:It bothers me. We're the only profession literally that well, first of all, common sense will tell you that absolutely every profession has their bad apples. Every profession Police, clergy, teachers, they all have their bad apples, but the law enforcement profession is the only one where people not everybody, but a group of people put a blanket judgment on us. You know, and it's just not fair, as I will tell you, and this means a lot to me that 98% of all the police officers are out there working hard, doing what's right, and they want to do this right and just protect the public. That's 98% of the people out there, maybe even higher than that. You only hear about the bad ones, which they should be punished, in fact, one of the truly bad ones. I'll lock them up myself because that's despicable, and actually they should be punished worse than the average person because they're put in a spot of where they're supposed to do right Authority and power.
Speaker 3:yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and they don't, and that's despicable to me. So, yes, throw the book at them, right, but most of us are not, and it's just not fair and it actually makes it. I mean, you have to defund the police and all that stuff and that's just. Whoever came up with that was an idiot. I'm sorry, but they're an idiot Because thankfully, that's turning around a little bit, because you don't have to defend the police. But you're not doing yourselves a favor either, because all that does is weaken your law enforcement community, and they won't want to make you less desirable to go out there and do what you're supposed to do as a cop, you know. So it's not good.
Speaker 2:It's not good at all.
Speaker 3:Well, I really hope for the people that do listen to this. They've come to understand the sacrifices and things that you don't see, right. You just you see them driving around and people maybe think about the one that gave them a speeding ticket, or, but what you describe today is like what you never see, what you don't see.
Speaker 3:And you only got into the tip of the iceberg of it, right, Right. And I think if people understood that there were complete strangers willing to spend time away from their family, put these burdens on themselves and then put their life at risk for you, who they don't know, have some appreciation for that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's a shame that people try to use that as a political tool and I'm glad that's kind of waning a little bit. But I don't know if I in the atmosphere that we talked about, that occurred just a few years ago and still a little bit of it today, if I would do the same thing, if I'd be, if I'd want to go in that profession, even though I wanted to do the job the way it's supposed to be done. But I don't know if I.
Speaker 3:That's unfortunate, because there's a lot of good young Marios in their early 20s that are probably deciding, yeah, that are rudderless, and trying to figure out what they want to do, and maybe this isn't even anywhere on their radar because of that reason and that's really unfortunate yeah.
Speaker 2:You know, right now you have a lot of police departments that are hurting for police officers. They can't hire anybody, and that's part of the problem right there, because Cause it's not attractive to anybody anymore, you know. So you need people that are going to support you. It's getting better, I think. Hopefully it keeps getting better, but we'll see.
Speaker 3:The last question is as a dad, I don't want to, I don't want to force anything on the boys and just kind of guide them and let them make their own decisions. But do you? I do have an idea in my head of what I would like to have happen. Did you have some idea of what you wanted to have happen? And then, how do you think that that, as far as sports you're talking about, no, no, just like how you wanted your kids lives to turn out, versus what's what's actually happened it's.
Speaker 2:It's actually better than expected. I'm very proud of you. You know parents, they want their kids to grow up to be good, solid, good human beings, and that's what you guys have done, and that's I couldn't be happier with that. It just so happens, icing on the cake, that you guys are all very successful in things you've done, and so that's just a plus. So, yeah, we're proud.
Speaker 3:All right, we'll call it there. Thanks for coming on, dad, absolutely Glad to be here. Thanks for being on. Love you and we'll see you soon Love you too.
Speaker 2:All right, bye-bye, the Rockies ain't too far from here.
Speaker 1:If we drive all night, the cold, that will do you well in the mountain morning light. So let's ride, let's ride on through the rain. Come on and take me anywhere that you wanna be. Let's ride and let's ride. Let's follow the skyline and when we make it to the other side We'll find all the bluest guys.